[John Bennett]

I hear you on new accessories :).
L plates are hard to come by used, its one of those things if you want probably just best to go to RRS. Atleast you arent waiting months.

Fast glass definately helps no arguement. You should see what I shoot in/get away with when using the 85 f1.2.

The 500mm F4 gains a stop over the 400 (which i still shoot with) but I also often am using TCs. Both the 1.4 (f5.6) and the 2x(f8). The heron above was shot at first light and 1,000mm (2x TC) and f8.

Heres another first light Heron
ISO 1,250
1,000mm at f8 (2x TC)
1/1600

Long story short I included them as being WTs most are at first light or last light. The shot of the fawn runing and leaping with Geese all around him was taken at last light. It was actually getting dark/dusky.

I don’t doubt there might be occassions when I might be forced above iso 2000 but its not that often. When chasing WTs I usually lug my tripod as Im often shooting at slow SS and ISO under 2,000.

I could bump the ISO to 2,000 or 4,000 gaining 1 or two stops. When shooting under 1/100th with long glass 1/200th or 1/400th.?? Id just as soon stay under ISO 2000 and use my pod. Again keep in mind I have to meet very stringent IQ/QC, even some grain in shadows/color noise will see images turned down. So not all is equal.

I didnt chime in earlier as I try to avoid “recomendations”.
When I had the MKiin I considered the keeping the iin (still a great body) and getting a 5Dmkii for use when shooting landscapes, fishing/hiking etc. In the end I knew while it sounded good its not what floats my boat day in and day out and so went for the mkiv.
So I waited until I saw that you had decided one way or the other.

Its a alot of money, and its not my money. Im not comforatable swaying people one way or the other.

I feel fine *now* 😉 saying that for you I think you made the right decision.The mkiv is tailor made for wildlife/fast action/sports. Some people dont like the APS-H sensor. To me it represents the best of all blending a little of all the strengths of both crop bodies and FF and its wicked fast for action.

[John Bennett]

I wouldn’t say the MKiv is utterly fantastic at “high” ISOs. Operative word is “high” as what we call “high” today is relative to what was “high” yesterday. There are better bodies for high ISO performance.

However that to is relative. I do a ton of low light shooting and I as yet haven’t felt any need to shoot above ISO 2000. So what it gives up in some areas ( say high iso compared to another bodies ISO 6000 files) it makes up for with it’s own strengths/advantages.

What I find remarkable about it, is the file quality given it’s 1.3 crop (APS-H) and 17MP. When compared to some smaller files say 12MP (as in a 5D) or Full Frame bodies it compares very well.

At the end of the day, these days, its more about picking the body that best suits your *needs*. Theres more to high iso than just “noise”

Mike hope you dont mind. Both of these were shot in very little light.
ISO 1,000
500mm at f4
1/80th

ISO 1,000
1,000mm at f8
1/320th

ISO 1,000
500mm at f4.5
1/60th
(handheld) <

For the sports/wildlife/action shooter I don’t know if theres a better option. The combintion of file size, sensor size (1.3 crop vs FF or 1.6), Af capabilities, etc.

Your going to love it Mike. Theres no other way to describe it

[John Bennett]

I haven’t played with it myself, someone more knowledgeable than I explained it once a long time ago. I do know if I look through a cp with polarized glasses it’s wonky. Always take my glasses off when using them as you may not get what your seeing

[John Bennett]

Jason.
When stacking 2 CPs you negate the “polarising” effect but do gain additional light reduction. So in a sense its a ghetto ND but at the cost of polarising? Best just to get an ND imo.

Do you need it?
depends on what you like to do. The best time to do long exposures is in low light. The best time to waterfalls for cotton candy water is on overcast days or even a light rain/drizzle. In both cases you want a CP to cut the glare of rocks and foliage. If your shooting a scene with alot of green you want to start roughly 2/3rds underexposed. Fact of the matter is *we* are often out and about doing what we do at all times. If you want flowing cotton candy water mid day you *will* need one.
Shot around 1pm with a 2 stop GND, a CP and a variable ND set around -7
ISO 50
f14
13 seconds

I have and use a SR variable ND. I dont use it much but when I do I’m glad I have it. I can shoot flowing water *any* time of day or use it with fast glass to get a narrow DoF in brighter light when I still want a slower shutter speed.

ISO 50
f2.8 (for narrow DoF, I was panning and wanted nothing but my daughters face in focus)
1/15 for motion blur and panning

Its one of those things thats great to have when you *want* it but rarely used and pricey

Here Im shooting directly into the sun for a sunrise pic.
A G/B CP to change colors (-2 stops)
A 3 reverse GND ( to balance sky/sun/foreground)

But I also wanted motion blur in the waves and without the variable ND I couldnt get my SS slow enough given I shooting right into the rising sun ( if memory serves me right I set it around -5 stops)

ISO 100
f18
0.75 second

[John Bennett]

Swore I wouldn’t respond 🙂

Mike you can’t fix blown skies in PS. Anything above a white point of

[John Bennett]

I think it depends on where you want to go with it and that pertains to Tosh’s comments about treating it as a business. In some ways I kind of disagree with the sentiment that you “have” to do both to be successful.

Best peice of advice I got when I firt starting getting published was to stop treating it as a hobby with gravy, and start treating it as a business if I dont want to fall by the wayside or fail. If getting the odd picture published is all you want..aka hobby with gravy…Great, cherish it every time it happens. If you want something more, than just as any other “business” venture where your capital is at risk. In this “business” your capital exceeds financial investment and includes your “time”. As Tosh alluded you want to look at everything with regards to its marketability. Not only specific mages but where and how your spending your time. For simple example spending hours chasing X if theres no market? Or going and getting images that have a market? Wheres your time better spent?

Make a plan.

Define “success”.
When I started seriously trying to get published I read the doom and gloom ( and I dont disagree with it) however, in the almost 3 years since I’ve had somewhere around 100 images published in various things through NA.

As an “outdoor” lifestyle photographer only, that’s not bad.
Does it allow me to quit my day job? No. Ten years ago it probably would have such that it would enable me to work at 24/7.

So my point is…if *all* you want to concentrate on editorial then making it in todays “stock/freelance” world is as Tosh said a tall order, and writing will help in getting published but there are many avenues to persue of which editorial publication can be just one aspect.

[John Bennett]

I love the S90, I should caution though that it doesnt have good/great zoom. that depends on what your looking for.

Some samples.

extremely versatile, light weight and capable (imo)

[John Bennett]

Thats a stone fly in the corner of its mouth if you want something different

not socrazy about this one

[John Bennett]

Adam, a mono pod can serve as a wading staff. Ive used my manfrotto

[John Bennett]

Kurt we might in fact leave the camera at home, in truth on rare occassions I do. But that is more due to simply not wanting or needing images.

Im going to try this one last time, maybe ive worded it poorly.God knows I do that enough.

If this were a photography based “site” where everyone is a “photographer” and people are focused on “photography” those things i think have more “weight” if you will. Again Im not disputing the importance of light its the fundamental aspect to photography.

I was/am taking the approach that people here when asking for some help are “outdoors” people. We do things regardless of the light/weather and we want to improve the images we bring home whether they are in good/bad light, rain or shine. quick exaple the shots were in rain and desatured…”how” can I improve them next time..To me Id say lower iso as far as possible and use a cp because there will be a next time given what we all enjoy…and hence my comment “it goes without saying”.

. True yes, if you want your “best” images you should be shootig during the golden hours. But if johns son catches a great Brown at 1pm …
be that as it may.
Most here try to help people along, I know I comment as often as possible, put up shots for illustrative purposes. its the only time I post photos..cant recall the last time I put up pics for “props”.
Been doing it for years, countless threads, countless people…And after saying something that wasn’t disagreeing or disrepecting the opions expressed prior I really didn’t expect

No John, maybe you do, yada,yada. as though my opinion counted for squat…Im not going to appreciate it and willl have something to say.

on the topic of pods/filters. Both at different times will have more impact. Now this applies to me specificallly as a shooter (im more photojournalism recall). Ive had two ADs and my Stock Agency tell me ( I can copy the emails sent to all contributors).

We are no longer accepting under or over exposed skies.

In other words blow your “exposure” and it doesn’t matter what the subject or how good. I have “photo calls and wish list for 2010 through 2011” looking for bad light, bad weather images and I sell quite a few. Why?

because  always bring my cameera with me and well some leave it home 😉 just kidding but there is some truth in that. Editors are itching for picks no one else shoots. They have thousamds of grips/grins, nice light shots of guys casting……….

for an article on deer hunting swamps in bad weather (shot was taken in the rain).aka crap light 🙂

mid day, crap light

this shot Im willing to bet sells one day,probably in a safety article for back lakes and what to do when bad storm rolls in

its what “we” do..we dont stay in bed when conditions arent ideal.

if the article is casting in a strong head wind in nasty conditions (exageration) ….filters will do waaaay more for me, than pods.
Anyways you get the idea.but thats “me” i recognise that, said that.

[John Bennett]

Eric  there was no need to get snarky, none at all. I replied in kind
/shrug

The thread is entitled filters, hes asked about filters.
The fact is most of us simply enjoy, love photography. Virtually everyone here  enjoy spending time in the outdoors doing various activities. When I’m out out say fishing, or camping or for an afternoon hike it doesn’t matter what the light conditions are, Im going to want to home with images.

I’ll ask you striaght up, if you have plans to go fishing, camping this weekend and the weather turns  ar you trashing your plans or leaving your camera at home because the lights going to less than great? if you answer yes….my appologies…if you answer no then think about it.As I said, no need, none at all to get snarky.

The other thing is most “novices” or enthusiest ..while understanding light is a key part to improving ( note I didnt take exception), they are looking for help in general…so if he goes for a fall hike and wants to come home with images and would like them to be better.
Should he stay home if the lights less than great. The a difference between not taking exception to the suggestion better light and…….

Filters are a “tool”, an accessory. The be all, end all..no. You can do quite well without. You can do quite well without a tripod as well if you choose. They can/will improve most outdoor/landscape photography regardless of the light. Bottom line. And for me anyways Id leave my tripod at home before I leave my filters. In fact I often do

As i originally said even in good light filters will make a big difference and can be the difference between a lanscape with a blown sky (delete) and a keeper…if not a wall hanger 😉

am i wrong?

[John Bennett]

Eric in case he doesnt see the thread you should probably email or pm Douglas Barnes. He is definately one of the Commercial photographers on the board.

Stock, editorial, promtional.
When I’m offered an assignment compensation takes into account
Travel
Day rate/hours on location.
Post work
The “wish list”. The larger, harder the list the greater the comp is.

Regardless.
In return they get one year *exclusive* rights to all images from the shoot to pick and choose which they want to use when and how they see fit……until the year expires.

While I’m sure there some differences I imagine there are similiarities to.

[John Bennett]

And Adam uses filters in all his stuff good light or not. And how would many/most of his shots turn out if he didn’t use them. So thank you for helping to make my point, agreeing with me, even while flinging a barb or two 🙂 Thats quite an accomplishment.

Does Adam use filters all the time.
That would be default mean to Adam they are indespensible Yes?

I didn’t dispute the importance of light I am saying that filters are an important tool, not to be overlooked or downplayed  even when shooting in good light .

And if you go back to Johns post, he specifically asked about *filters* and how they might improve the shots. Not how do I improve my photos? How will *filters* improve my photos. So you tell me, a) whos actually trying to answer his question and b) how do think Adam would have replied.

I think he might have said something to the effect of
I dunno, even in good light

[John Bennett]

Lol thanks Dave.

You’ll get there (if not now) and when you do, you realise theres still a ton of room for improvement.

One of the things I love about photography, you could spend a lifetime at it and never get to a point where you can’t improve. My “favorites” at this point are likely shots

[John Bennett]

I dunno.
I think it goes without saying that good light makes a huge difference. However as people that shoot outdoor lifestyles we usually don’t have much choice and its upon us to shoot in whatever the conditions are.

if you look at those pictures I posted above not one of them except perhaps the last with the drift boat was taken in good light. All of them in fact were taken between 11am and 4pm to boot.

would better light have improved them or opened more doors? Im willing to bet on it, but then again I had to make the best of what mother nature gave me.

Good light?

or knowing how to use various to tools available to us to make the best out of whats there. Good light, or not. And yes there are 2 filters used in that and a flash

My point here is you can have the sweetest light ever recorded and the image could be ruined without filters if theres a big difference beteen foreground/sky or even left/right. or if not ruined/near impossible the right filters will enable you to improve on it.

[John Bennett]

Im going to echo what Buzz said.

If it’s in the budget and tripod work is important get the best tripod/head you can. Even if you need to save $$ for a period of time, in the long run its worth it.

*Do* take into account every possible application you might think of. Because they are all different. I decided on a Gitzo Carbon explorer. ( think its the 2227)

Why?
Well first because its sturdy enough for my body and heaviest lenses. But also because I wanted the offset, adjustable center column, rather than a straight head for macro work.
http://www.outbackphoto.com/reviews/equipment/canon_10D/400_sd9_0000_00210_GitzoExplorer.jpg

There are a number of good carbon makers out there now beyond Gitzo. Have a look at them if your yearning for Carbon.

Then give though to your head.
Gitzo, Really Right Stuff, Wimberly, Markins, Manfrotto

regardless, try as much as you can to get the best (sturdiest) you can and if need be go to a shop with your heaviest body/lens and test

[John Bennett]

As I mentioned on FB Mike, having gone through something while different mine left in an equally brutal way/time.

You do recover.

I won’t lie, the next few months are going to test you. Lawyers, bankers will all want their peice of you as you unravel and then start to put it back together….on your own.

friends and family will say they right things, but they will sound just like words. Then one day it happens

For me the magic moment came when she was puling her usual bs and “bossing” me around with regards to selling the house. My reply was ” FO I dont answer to you anymore”.

when you get there and you will, everything starts going back up hill. In the meantime and the intervening months ( for everyone its different). Go fishing, do whatever it is, you need to do to take care of you and your child.

[John Bennett]

No problem.

Step up rings.
Are “rings” that fit one diamter (smaller) of lens on the male end and accept a larger screw in filter on the female end. They are adapters.

All my filters with the exception of a B/W 72mm CP are 77mm filters. Most of my lenes are 77mm as well, except for a couple that are 72mm.

If I want to use a 77mm filter ( say my B/G CP) on a lens thats only 72mm, I use a 72>77mm “step up” ring. The ring fits on the end of th 72mm lens and the 77mm filter then screws in to the larger female end of the ring. As the filter is larger than the lens theres no issues optically. You cant for example use a smaller filter on a larger lens.
Step up rings cost about $15.

Thus its best to buy the largest filters you think you need/want and if you want to use one on a smaller lens, you spend 15 bucks on the appropriate step up ring.

“Fast” enough.
Thats what Ive been trying to show 🙂

f2.8 is “borderline” imo for indoor sports. Its useable but it will be hard getting above 1/500th in most standard gyms.

F1.8 is preferable. It will allow more light in resulting in higher shutter speeds all else equal. Good lenses are the 500mm f1.8 and 85mm f1.8

As above at ISO 2000 and with a lens at f1.2 I was getting 1/1600th. Same lighting, same ISO; had I set the lens to f2.8 or used an f2.8 lens my SS would only have been 1/320th.

[John Bennett]

Processed a bit.
White balance was corrected on some, standard sharpening, ( dont recal if theres any NR).

rest of the shots here
http://jben.zenfolio.com/p553372392

The problem your experiencing John is that your lens wasn’t “fast” enough. I’ve yet to shoot in a gymnasium (VB or gymnastics) that had even remotely decent lighting. If its the 70-200 f4, I wouldnt expect it to fare a lot better, all else equal.

In the absence of a “fast lens” (f2.8 and wider) your only recourse is to ramp up your iso. Depending on your body that may introduce unacceptable levels of noise. Most NR programs can do a good job these days of taming noise w/o destroying detail. If a little noise is present in your shots, some NR will clean it up, if theres a lot of noise you’ll have to decide between moderate NR or heavy NR which will start wiping out detail the more aggressive you are with NR.

Depending on the shots you want there are other things you can do. Time your shots so that jumpers are at their apex (hang time) and motion “slows” excluding their arms as they strike. etc, etc. If you work hard on tracking their torso you can “freeze” their body.Until your acheiving shutter speeds around 1/1000th and higher the ball and likekly limbs will suffer some motion blur.

1/1250th

regarding filters.
Its a good idea to buy filters for the largest lens you have, or think you’ll have. While the filter may be too big for smalled lenses, you can use step up rings with no problems.

All my filters are 77mm (exlcuding a 4th cp thats 72mm). If I wanted to buy say Canons 16-35 which is an 82mm thread Id be replacing over 3 or 4 filters..At 350-450 each. Buying that lens today would cost me over 3g ( filters incl). It doesnt affect me because I havel little desire for that lens, however if it was on my “want” list every single filter ever bought would be 82mm and step up rings used to the 77mm lenses I own.

[John Bennett]

Thanks Brett.

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