bob bolton
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Well Carter…Actually I did catch a 10 pound salmon by hand a couple of years ago on a bet. Grabbed him by the tail with a rubber dot glove and flipped him out on the bank. I threw him right back because the DNR might take a dim view of it. And I have hooked a brick but I couldn’t land it. 🙂
We probably got off on the wrong foot. I understand and respect your method for giving large fish a “come along” especially in big water out of a boat with a ton of line out. I think it is a marvelous idea that I wouldn’t have thought of. It will probably be of use on fish such as tarpon. In fact, we use it all the time to dislodge snags across the river on the other side of an active redd or a deep hole.
My point though poorly stated was actually this. I hear all the time on other sites that you don’t ever have to worry about breaking your rod because the leader will always break first. This probably leads less experienced anglers to pull away with their new Z axis on fish, snags (salmon on the redd), or other obsticles such as other anglers, thinking all the time that their rod is not in danger. I have seen people flip their rod against a snag in younder high bush cranberry and snap it right off. That is what prompted my “brick” anology not knowing that people actually practice that technique.
So my analogy was not aimed at you or your technique. It was prompted by a common opinion held by some that their rod is invincable because the leader is so weak. You and I both know that is certainly not true.
All that being said, are we still friends?
Godspeed,
Bob
And I am sure all that works just fine for you. Wouldn’t work well for people in my area. I am standing in a 30 foot wide river with a big fish breathing in my waders. Everything I have just said works just fine for me. If you ever get a steelhead
Soooo — you are not lifting the weight with the rod, you are lifting it with the line. I can buy that explanation.
Back to my original statement, you can’t lift a 6 pound weight with the rod expecting the leader to break before the tippet does. When you point the rod at the fish, sure the tippet will break first because you are not using the rod. That’s how you break off a snag without hurting the rod. But any sizable fish will break you off with a twitch of his head if you do not have bend in the rod. There is no substitute for using a properly set drag to tire the fish with the rod bent ( sideways or up ways to keep the shock down on the tippet). The main reason we turn the rod sideways with steelhead is to turn the fish to try and keep him in front of you instead of him bolting downstream with you running after. You can break a rod just as easily that way if you have the drag set too high.
You can play a fish pointing the rod at the fish. Just pray he is nearly exausted and doesn’t plan on going aerial.
BTW we call dropping the rod on a jump as “bowing to the jump’. It gives slack so when the fish snaps his head back and forth in the jump, so he doesn’t break your rod. But you have to give him enough slack so he doesn’t break the tippet as well because there is no bend in the rod to save it.
I have caught many 10-14# steelhead on 4 and six point tippets but I am always aware if you bend into that fish, you can break that rod long before the tippet snaps. My original premise stands.
I dug around in the basement and found a spare tip for my eight weight and since I haven’t ever broken a rod on a fish (except that one time which was my fault) I probably will be okay. But I won’t tell “you know who” how it happened if I do send it back. 😉 BTW I like my 8 weight Sage much better than the Orvis.
Godspeed,
Bob
Well Carter, you got me.
Don’t anyone else try this. I got out my 8 weight Orvis which has a lifetime on it. The 6 pound weight didn’t even budge before the rod snapped. Not at a ferrule either – right in the middle. I just can’t resist a challenge but Carter, that wasn’t nice.
And I was using just the handle in normat casting position. I’ll send it back to Orvis and get a new one but, as I said before, I’ll bet I know what is going to happen if you try.
Maybe Orvis rods are just junk – but they are the only ones I have with a gurantee.
Bob
Just a point for those who think the leader should break before the rod. Most leaders being used for big fish with an 8 weight will be 6 pounds or over. We even use 10 lb leaders at night for browns. And salt water leaders are 12 pound plus before the shock (tooth) tippet. If you think you can put as much force on a rod as you want and the leader will always break first, try tying a 6 pound brick to the tip top of your rod and pick it up. Bet I know what is going to happen.
IMHO the most common problem in rod breakage is damage. Second is user error. Usually by palming too hard on the reel, especially when the fish jumps (like tarpon or steelhead) and not giving line. Also, setting the drag too high and grabbing the rod half way up the first section with the fighting butt jamed in your belly because your right hand got too tired. Sometimes when you do that in the heat of a fight and you get the line too. I did that once and the reel seat broke off the handle and my Billy Pate went for a swim. I handed the rod to the guide, fished out the reel and seat with the line, and we kept on fighting the steelhead. I was winding and he was holding the rod. Would have even been a better story if we had landed the fish. He was a nice 14+ pound fish. Course I tell everyone he was 18+ pounds around the campfire.
And in winter, if your guides ice up during a fight, the drag on the line will go way up. Plus the fact that graphite composite gets really brittle when cold.
But don’t ever count on a heavy leader breaking before your rod. Better have a lifetime on that one because you will be sending it back.
Car doors are rough on rods too.
Godspeed,
Bob Bolton
Eric,
I must be totally out of touch. What are you surf fishing for? The only surf fishing I have heard of with a fly rod is carp. It is supposed to be a lot of fun but I wonder if your talking something else?
Bob
Joel,
You might enjoy this if you are into steelhead.
http://www.hatofmichigan.org/uploads/TyingFlies_ebook.pdfIMHO there is no more fun in fresh water than steelhead. But to each his own.
Godspeed,
Bob Bolton
Just for fun.
Flies tied completely from Orvis closed cell foam (except for hackle).
Tied these up because I got tired of using the dryer on a float trip.
Called Bob’s Neversink and they don’t.
BWO, Drake, and Hendrickson
Bob Bolton
I see a lot of variation in brown trout color. I have noticed (from pictures) that western browns don’t have nearly as much deep yellow and orange on their lower bodies and fins as Michigan browns do. It’s a very interesting post. Can’t wait to hear more. Bet it’s either food or its genetic. Or maybe water chemestry, or maybe temperature – heck, I don’t know.
Bob
I have a place in Naples. It is in a gated community that borders in the back with the Everglades. When they get a forest fire, they try to put it out with bags on choppers that they fill out of the lakes in our complex. The lakes are full of red eared sunfish, so I am sure they scoop them up and drop them on the fire too. Bad day to be a fish. I am sure this puts them down.
Pictures of chopper and fire . They couldn’t put it out so they just let it burn up to the complex and turned on the sprinklers. Nothing inside would burn anyway – all tile roofs.
Bob Bolton
I have a Lightspeed 3.5 and I also have an Evolution. Both are nice reels. I have heard 2 complaints about Litespeed’s. First – some of the older models do not have stainless steel one way roller clutches. Occasionally they would give up big time and go into a free spinning mode. If you contact Lamson, they will send you stainless roller clutches for older models. I think the new ones are annodized red
Nothin spectacular this weekend Eric. A few teeners like this on Sat nite – nothing Fri.
This is just the only picture I took.When a night time brown slams a big muddler, they usually hit so hard they hook themselves. If they miss, wait a few minutes and go right back to the same spot. So will he, if he didn’t taste steel the first time through. He will hit again.
Has anyone ever used any of those red LED headlamps. I have one and it works great . You don’t loose your night vision when you snap it on. But does it scare browns like a white light does? I know if you shine them with white, they will split . They’ll come back in five or ten minutes but you have to wait. I was just wondering if it was the same with red. Maybe just hoping….
I fish small streams at night. You can’t effectively fish a streamer withiut being able to lay out the path you want to mend line to get propper streamer motion. All big topwater mice, frogs, muddlers, etc. Lots of deer hair.
Bob Bolton
See Chapter 1 of “You Can’t Make a Living Tying Flies” at http://www.HATofMichigan.org – go to the e-book page and download the book – or not. You will need Adobe Reader. But there is an intresting reason why I didn’t start until I was 40 years old. You might enjoy it.
Bob Bolton
Eric,
BTW – my post picture is on the PM at Alligator Alley a number of years ago. I’ll post on browns this weekend.Bob Bolton
