“Those fish would easily break an 8wt”
- This topic has 31 replies, 17 voices, and was last updated Dec 5, 2007 at 12:38 am by
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I think your points are right on. 90% of time a rod breaks it due to user error. I’m including lead eyes hitting the blank in this as well. I have seen two rods break to manufactoring error. The first was my brothers Scott two-hander which exploded right above the cork on a cast. It also happened to him again on the same rod about two weeks after getting it back from Scott. The other rod that I have seen break was a Scott S3S, that crazy interal male end of the ferrule just broke and slide back down into the blank, and this was straight out of the tube.
A 9wt. is a little bit stronger, but not by much. An 8wt. should have no problem handling a salmon. You would be surprised the amount of pressure that you can put on a rod. Does a heavier weight rod make it easier to land a fish,well yes. But you also have to take the anglers skill into play. I personally love using a lighter rod for big fish. When I go after big carp 20+ I use a 6wt. I have even landed a 15lb carp on my 4wt. I landed all of them in under 5 minutes, not to mention putting a ton of pressure on them to keep them out of log jams. Its all about gettinga the right angle on the fish.
Andrew…what about fiberglass? (I know…I always like to stir that pot.) There are several fellows…even one that lives in AK that fishes fiberglass only for salmon species of all types. It is a rare thing, compared to graphite, to find a fiberglass rod broken from a fish.
Mike McFarland is about to introduce heavy weight (7-9 weight) single hand and then several spey style fiberglass rods.
I’m of the opinion that a rod breaks for one of three reasons: User Error, Manufacturer’s Defect, or a Nick in the graphite (which is probably just a specific user error). What I’m getting at is if a salmon does indeed break your 8wt, it is most often your fault. The drag was set too high, your leader test is too high, or maybe it was the clouser slamming the rod on your forward cast. Point being…unless you are trying to pull a salmon out from under a tree jam…something else should break before the rod.
Now I’m well aware that this is a generalization, and that there are probably plenty of counter examples out there. I would certainly be interested in hearing some since I have yet to break a fly rod.
I envy those of you who have not broken a rod. I haven’t been that lucky and I am in agreement with Andrew that user error is the biggest factor. Although I’ve landed some very large fish on lightweight rods, Last year I broke two rods–A Sage 5wgt and a St Croix 7wgt. One on fish the other while falling on my ass streamside. This year I’ve broken two Sages-a 5wgt when I dumped my kayak in rapids and just last week I broke my 7wgt XP on a two pound lizard fish. My kayak was anchored on a pothole in four feet of water and 10 mph winds. The Lizard fish went directly under the boat upwind bending the rod almost double and the second section from the tip just snapped. No doubt the countless hits from tungsten cones, beads and dumbells all summer long weakened that spot on the rod. Thank God for lifetime warranties. At 60 years old I am pretty confident that I am going to fall out of my kayak again and fall on my ass more than once in the next few years–User Error, its inevitable.
… The drag was set too high, your leader test is too high, or maybe it was the clouser slamming the rod on your forward cast. Point being…unless you are trying to pull a salmon out from under a tree jam…something else should break before the rod.
Generally though, would you all agree with this?
Andrew, Frist of all, I like the way you lay out your thought! good thread!
I agree…totally
Besides your list, there is one more thing I have to point out is the rod position Some of people put the rod, or set the rod into a dangerous/jeopardy position…said waiting for the breaking moment… ;D
Hmmmm… make a example… how many times you hooked into a tree or even the Earth, and you never break a rod. Because you pointed your rod to the object and break the leader off.
My point is you can exert power to your rod from zero (point to the fish) to maximum (backward 180 degree to the fish) by change the leverage/position.I saw people fighting a tarpon with a broken rod (on video)… literally he was fighting a fish with a reel and line and he land the fish…not bad…(this is definitely no fun)…. I am not saying we should fight a fish like this. I just want to point out that we can adjust the power to the rod and fish during the fight more adaptively to prevernt some unexpected happen. 😉
Here is a fun video…http://www.fliesandfins.com/fishvideos/false-albacore-fly-rods.wmv
Not a very good idea for a fly rod + a lunker… 😮
Two things I didn’t like about that video Yuhina. One, it made me sea sick and two I was not impressed with the release of the fish. Otherwise it was entertaining.
Andrew I don’t think you have anything to worry about as you have obviously already thought this out pretty well. That said I would make sure you bring a spare rod just incase of user err.
;D Joel…
Can’t not help the sea sick part…
Although I have not fish for bonitos…
I have “heard” bonitos have to be released “that way”… to “wake” them up…
Maybe some people have more experience here can explain that to me…I know this group of people… I know they are respectful to fish and enviroment… no worries about the ethic issue… 😉
Andrew
I agree with you 100%.
IMO, if the rod breaks, its been previously damaged, or it’s a case of pilot error, such as a loop around the tip, drag set too tight, or high sticking a fish, etc.Did you guys also notice that their rods broke right above where they had their hand on the blank in the video.
Andrew I think you’ve hit the nail on the head. The leader or something should break before the rod unless unnecessary high stick or poor technique is involved. Even the drag setting shouldn’t be an issue really…
Having said that, an eight might be an inappropriate weight, I haven’;t fished up there, but rod breakage shouldn’t be the problem in my opinion.
You can judge a man by the size of things which annoy him.
Andrew, tell your ‘fellow fishers’ to pound sand. First things first, there are 5 different species of salmon in Alaska, ranging from 2lb humpies to 50 lb+ kings. Everything is relative. If a humpy breaks an 8wt rod, something is seriously wrong. And while a big king can be landed on light gear, it wouldn’t be unheard of for something to break during the fight. I’ve personally landed kings up to 40 lbs on a 5 wt.
That said, a lot of the fast action rods being produced today seem brittle to me. Just one of the draw-backs to packing a ton of modules into a blank. But I do believe that beyond op error or a manufacturing defect, something else in your terminal tackle should let go before your rod self-destructs.
Fish confidently with a 3 wt for humpies, grayling, small trout, char. 5-6 wt for most trout, char. 7 wt for trophy trout and most everything else. A 9 or 10 wt might be reasonable if you really expect to hang a pig king. Take a spare, just in case. Nothing more humbling than begging a rod off of your buddy or the outfitter. Or fish an UglyStik and leave your worries at home.
And Cameron has a great point in fiberglass. I’d second the recommendation for McFarland, being a fine Pennsylvania company.
North!
RyanJust a point for those who think the leader should break before the rod. Most leaders being used for big fish with an 8 weight will be 6 pounds or over. We even use 10 lb leaders at night for browns. And salt water leaders are 12 pound plus before the shock (tooth) tippet. If you think you can put as much force on a rod as you want and the leader will always break first, try tying a 6 pound brick to the tip top of your rod and pick it up. Bet I know what is going to happen.
IMHO the most common problem in rod breakage is damage. Second is user error. Usually by palming too hard on the reel, especially when the fish jumps (like tarpon or steelhead) and not giving line. Also, setting the drag too high and grabbing the rod half way up the first section with the fighting butt jamed in your belly because your right hand got too tired. Sometimes when you do that in the heat of a fight and you get the line too. I did that once and the reel seat broke off the handle and my Billy Pate went for a swim. I handed the rod to the guide, fished out the reel and seat with the line, and we kept on fighting the steelhead. I was winding and he was holding the rod. Would have even been a better story if we had landed the fish. He was a nice 14+ pound fish. Course I tell everyone he was 18+ pounds around the campfire.
And in winter, if your guides ice up during a fight, the drag on the line will go way up. Plus the fact that graphite composite gets really brittle when cold.
But don’t ever count on a heavy leader breaking before your rod. Better have a lifetime on that one because you will be sending it back.
Car doors are rough on rods too.
Godspeed,
Bob Bolton
try tying a 6 pound brick to the tip top of your rod and pick it up. Bet I know what is going to happen.
Sorry, but lifting 6lbs with an 8wt is a pretty simple task (with the right practice) if you properly apply the preasure from the butt of the rod.
This is one of the best exercises you can do if you’re wanting to lay the hurt on some big fish with light tackle:
Get some weights and something secure about 2 -3 feet of the ground that you can mount a pulley to (truck bumper/trailer hitch works well), run the line through it and start pulling. Start at really low angles and work upwards from there, you’ll figure out where the best preassure points on your rods are. Some of ya’ll are thinking this over too hard, no offense. It’s like casting, you’ve got to get out on the lawn and practice if you want to be even halfway good at it.
Well Carter, you got me.
Don’t anyone else try this. I got out my 8 weight Orvis which has a lifetime on it. The 6 pound weight didn’t even budge before the rod snapped. Not at a ferrule either – right in the middle. I just can’t resist a challenge but Carter, that wasn’t nice.
And I was using just the handle in normat casting position. I’ll send it back to Orvis and get a new one but, as I said before, I’ll bet I know what is going to happen if you try.
Maybe Orvis rods are just junk – but they are the only ones I have with a gurantee.
Bob
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