Karlin Bilcher
Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
1. The Fly’s –
The better shops / guides that I am familiar with work the price of a dozen or half dozen fly’s directly into the price of the trip. What you don’t loose you keep. If you don’t want to keep them its an easy way to round out a guides tip. Nothing kills the stoke like nit-picky fly issues at the end of the day, better to have it worked into the bottom line at the start. You “settled up” at the end of the day? That’s poor form on them, all that jazz should be out of the way before the day starts, strictly between client and outfitter. They serve as a business layer between client and guide. This way the guide can be Mr. Fun working hard to assure a decent tip and not tangled up in the business aspects.2. The Destination –
This is super tricky. You don’t want to put off your guide at the start of the day by being all kinds of demanding. However, he should have done a much much better job getting on the same page with you. “I don’t care how many fish I land, I want to explore new water, learn new access, figure out new approaches…etc…etc.” That’s a totally reasonable conversation to be had first thing. It’s your day! He should be making you priority one, at the same time you want to keep your guide happy to a degree – listening to them, paying close attention, following the rules of the game, etc. Super dicey.Was it near the end of the season? My guess is that it was…perhaps you got a fried guide. This is where Zach’s on the button with the “guide convince” issue. Where you fishing in a permitted area? For example, lots of western rivers here in Wyoming and Idaho outfitters are only allowed to send a certain number of boats through a certain section of river based on their permit. First time out- of-towner’s who “don’t know any better” are not offered an option of where to go and are sent to river sections with open slots for that particular day.
3. The Shop Owner
You should definitely speak to the shop owner and gently explain the situation. I am sure they would want to know. A close friend of mine just got fired, after 2 seasons, from a large reputable outfitter because of too many similar complaints about him. He’s my buddy and all, but his canning was completely justified.Sorry you got burned.
A bit more on the guide school question…however this is more of tangental rant than an answer to the original question.
A weird thing happens sometimes with fly fishing guides. The weird thing promotes their business but at the same time it creates an illusion of grander. After a handful of successful seasons guiding they begin to believe that their “success” is disproportionately about them and not the incredible natural resource that they have the privilege of sharing with others. In this soil the seeds of arrogance are planted. A truly good guide is humble before the river, gracious to their clients and has optimum fun (and safety) as their priority. Hiring a guide is more about the resource you have the privilege of experiencing, not about your hired docent for the day. However that spirit does not generate the most bookings – aggrandizing self promotion does. So its a tight walk for these folks. And the fly fishing laity play into this mix willfully ascribing savant status to a fellow fisherman that happens to be a local.
You occasionally see a bumper sticker in my town that says, “Fishing guides – not Gods”. I’ve always wondered if this snark is directed at guides for their egos or the clients for their expecations?
Guide schools are selling an image and a lifestyle to folks who believe myths about what it takes to be a good fishing guide. The primary thing that separates a top quality guide from most jokers out there is caring. Caring! About your clients, about the resource, about a quality lunch a couple of other things that make for a fun day. No guide school can teach you to care. A giant ego, a formulaic scripted day on the water and bong resin stifle ones ability to truly care.
Before “which” guide school,the question is “why” guide school?
I am a guide school alum and have a couple of reflections that might be worth something…or not. After fly fishing most of my life, in the East and 4 years in Alaska, I ended up settling in a mountain town in the inter-mountain West. Hands down one of the troutiest places on the planet. I needed to learn to row a drift boat. My school goal was to move from getting the boat down the river safely to what they call – fishing through the anglers – while on the ores. I guess the school helped me achieve this goal, but it most certainly was not necessary to do so. I wished I had saved the 2k and just spent that time on the water with my trout bum buddies. They would have loved to have me row for a week straight – I would have learned a hell of a lot more and saved 2k.
Be careful. Do your homework. By in large, guide schools, just like every other fishing product that puts “guide” in the title is selling a lifestyle, not really doing the hard work of education, training, mentoring, etc. The other folks in my guide school class were college kids who’s grandparents were on the board of directors of prominent fishing companies (yea, whatever 2 or 3 just came to your mind…yup those) and they had nothing else to do between summer school semesters at Colorado State. They were not invested in the school. Which I found a little frustrating because I saved my pennies, took a week off of work and actually did a bunch of homework before hand. In addition, just like the questionable origins of the now prestigious Jackson Hole One Fly, guide schools are a cash cow for outfitters unable to book trips during run off or low water periods. The way permitting works out here, your guide school time on the water is going to be spent in water unoccupied by the outfitters regular sports. For example, there was an amazing drake hatch busting on one local drainage, my buddies called, I told them I couldn’t join because it was my guide school week. While they were casting size 12 drys to square noses, I was floating down 17k cfs of chocolate milk with Cheech and Chong in the boat…guide school.
Jeff, you seem like you’ve got this fly fishing thing pretty dialed and you’ve got the passion. If the 2k is no biggie and your looking for some kind of vacation, go for it. If you’re serious about a guiding future, school might be required. If you just want some next level stuff in your FF arsenal, I don’t think “guide” school is where you’ll find it. My recommendation – call Trout Hunter in Island Park ID – book a week solo with their top guide, someone like Pat Gaffney. You’ll be in the bow, he’ll be on the sticks, you’ll get a serious education!!!!! One thing no school can ever teach – caring. I live and work among lots of fishing guides, many of them simply don’t care about the things that you care about.
To work as a guide most outfitters now a days require either 2 years as a shop rat or a guide school diploma. (AK is way looser) If guiding is your next move, then go for it. However, Jeff, you seem like you’ve got this FF thing pretty dialed. My guess is you might be sorely disappointed in the “guide school product”.
The Hank offers something like 60 miles of floatable water. Huge amounts of diversity there in. Island Park and The Ranch are their own style, flat, mostly wading. The water above and below Ashton are the closest to me. You can spend a lifetime just on that drainage and not fish it all. Unless of course you are Mike Lawson.
My son checking out an early season box canyon bow.
there’s one…
Attachments:
ZM –
I understand you posted photo’s of an article you wrote on your site looking for comments, got it. Comments are what I offered.
I’d be surprised if it was your intention for The Itinerant Angler site to take on a “Zack Matthews Facebook page” type feel. Seriously?
KBOutside, Forbes, Field and Stream publish this article or something similar every couple of years. However, it is groundbreaking in its own way: Posting pictures… of an article you wrote… containing hero shots… of yourself… on your own web site – holy crap! Now that’s classy. An amazing height of self promotion.
IM PRESS IVE.“But a great many “brands” you see are just re-badges of commercially available blanks and tapers. I have actually been approached myself about “designing” a line of rods, as have most of the bigger fly shops in this country. Some of those fly shops have gone ahead with house brands.”
Hey Z –
Can you please tell us more about who approached you to design rods and why? Was it because of your celebrity status or your influence being equivalent to “most of the bigger fly shops”. As Lefty is to TFO so Zach is to…..? Fascinating stuff. A little background would be awesome.
KbMichael –
In the past couple of years the issue you raised regarding rear casting braces, walking around the boat has become more and more of a bigger deal to me. Seems like a simple solve and some manufactures are figuring it out. A slender brace fixed to the floor in the back that does not box-in the rear fisherman and a pedestal rowers seat seems to be all it takes. This would allow smooth passage from bow to stern and vice vera for everyone on board. Navigating the oars / oarsman not withstanding. Talking about this issue with the dude on the drift boat lot near my house I learned that the pedestal rower seat is a sticky-wicket. He got super geeked out and technical but from what I gathered, for the pedestal rower seat to function properly given the stress on the hull and the slight bending the floor goes through, to be designed properly, the seat ought to be mounted on a raised floor separate from the hull. All very interesting. He just got in a Clacka Fly Pod, designed by Kelly Galloup, very nice and easy to walk around. Attended the Film Tour in Jackson Hole last week which got my fly fishing motor running at high speed. Any day now.
KbI caught the second half of the show and programed it into my DVR. I will be tuning in with great anticipation. From my time at a Western PA fly shop got to know a few of the National Youth FF team members and many more hopefuls. Seems like central PA is an area of the country that is producing lots of interest and excitement in competitive fly fishing.
George Daniel’s is an absolute gem, one of the greatest ‘younger’ guys in the industry. He’s a humble, kind, tried and true fish-er-man. Not some wanna-be rocky mountain, missoula Mt…’here’s a picture of me enjoying a warm PBR by a fire with my bro’s’, techno gear head, poser.
Back to the show, it’s well done. The “watch me catch fish” show is so incredibly played out. What seems to distinguish In the Loop is personal backstory presented through multiple voices and appealing camera work. Looking forward to next Tuesday.
Kb
Zach –
I think Bob Dylan said it best, “everybody must get stoned.” He wasn’t talking about the ganja, he was talking about critique.
My favorite I T podcasts are the ones that feature fisherman like Ed Engle, Kelly Gallop and others. In some ways I happen to agree with COHonk. That’s why I shared similar words with you about two years ago through PM when you requested feedback on the pod casts. My main point was this – how about more conversation with folks who can actually weald a fly rod and fewer conversations with corporate big wigs who know how to run a company or sell products. If The Drake is – ‘for those who fish’, perhaps Itinerant is – ‘for those who talk about fishing products’. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy some fishing product conversation from time to time, but at the end of the day what winds my clock is setting the hook. There are lots of wonderful podcasts out there, Orvis and Moldy Chum are great. Your’s fits it’s own niche I guess. Lot’s of people enjoy your work. You have made a name for yourself in the FF industry, congrats.
Lastly, is ‘COHonk’ a member of this board? Because you address him as though he has the chance to reply and explain what he meant.
KbAnyone ever seen the vid – “The Underwater World of Trout”. It’s amazing stuff by some crazy scuba video guy, I think he goes by Ozzie. It’s dated and of very low production quality. Anyway, he documents hours of underwater video of wild trout in their natural habitat. One of the main points of his work is to show that the major way that a trout perceives its world is through its mouth. They are constantly taking things into their mouth and rejecting them in an instant – sticks, grass, pebbles, cigarette buts, anything that naturally drifts past their face.
The best fly in any situation in any water at any time for any trout – is a drag free drift! Not sure how this applies to high level salt water predators but I imagine presentation, cast, strip, movement ect. wins the day in those situations.I think Simms is rarely tops when it comes to the “bang for the buck” criteria. Your dollar can go farther with other companies. Sure, their gear is alright, but you pay out the nose for it. As I’ve said over and over on this site, what’s your application? You live in PA, right? Far from the wettest fishing region out there, if you spend 20 days a year fishing in Sitka Alaska or coastal Oregon then its a different story.
Once the application question is settled the next question is Gore Tex vs. non-Gore Tex. This is a tricky one. You pay more for gore-tex but do you require it? The shelf life on all laminates is shorter than gore tex, and the breathability is less. I am not up on the most recent technological advances in non-gore rain proof / breathability stuff. Perhaps there is some stuff out there that is comparable, not sure. But that is what I would consider next. My guess is that Zach is up on this world and would gladly drop his dope tehcno knowledge here for us…
