jon marcus
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Although this has nothing to do with the price or cost of fly rod warranties, the discussion has moved much in the direction of retail pricing so– I’ll add my 2 cents worth. This is an area I know well as to the differences between high and low turn-over retailers. Something that is almost always left out of discussions of this sort is turn rate. This is the number of times the entire stock of a retailer turns over in one year. So consider this: It’s my understanding that the average chain grocery store has a turn rate of about 52. I’m not sure what their average mark up is, but I seem to remember once hearing 20%. That would mean that 1/6 of the price of goods is gross profit. If the grocery store carries $150,000.00 in goods, (assuming, for the sake of disscussion, that is…) then gross sales for the year is: $7.800,000.00. This results in gross profits of: $1,300,000.00. This is brought in by “churning” that original $150,000.00 investment 52 times over the course of a year. In other words, 866.666% return on the grocers original investment in goods. Now to be fair, the expenses of running the grocery store are very high and at years end the net profits are nothing like this 866+%. I don’t know the turn rate in fly shops, but I gaurantee you that it’s far lower than a grocery store. In jewelry stores, it seems to be rather uniform, around 1 (one) give or take 20%, in all stores–chain or mom and pop. That’s why there are still a lot of independant jewelers. The big chains don’t get the high turnover of goods that many chain operations get so they must make it on big mark-ups even though their cost of goods is lower. So–my point is that all low turn rate retailers must survive by a higher mark up!! I can gaurantee you that the mark-up in fly shops is lower than that in jewelry stores. I just watched our best local sporting goods/fly shop go under after many decades in business. I wanted to put this into the discussion because the great majority of persons, not having primary (Owner, manager, etc.) retail experience do not understand these little-known, yet all pervasive facts that have a major effect on the the price of goods. (Fly Rods, of course!!)
Now–the balancing consideration is this: When high volume discount retailers move into new areas (Wal-Mart being the prime example) they put many small retailers out of business and the rate of Food Stamp needs go sharply upwards–a cost to the community that these big retailers fail to pay for. I’m not going to draw any further conclusions about the cost of fly fishing goods. I simply wish to shine a little more information into the discussion.
Regards, Marc
I live on northern Puget Sound and my friends and I fish a lot for steelhead and salmon. Been doing this for over 25 years. We cast a lot of very heavy lines and flys and do this with everything from 6 wt. SH rods to 15′ 10/11 Spey rods. I fished the Grand Ronde last fall and mostly used a 6 wt. and dredged with weighted flies & added weight. What I am getting at is that if one’s rod breaks simply from casting, it is, in my opinion, defective. Never in the past 25 years to my knowledge have any of our rods broken just by casting–no matter what–except for 3 that I know of that were found to be definitely defective. 2 of these were the tips on Sage LL 389’s (the original ones) that were built on “second” blanks. Both seemed to be missing hoop wraps. (didn’t involve the ferrules, though) I have one, love it and have had no problems–ditto my friends #3. The other was an 8′ 7wt. Montague Bamboo. Because of the constrictive ferrules they used they are all defective from the get.
As for the subject of loose ferrules–I’ve had some problems with this from time to time and these were all due to one of three problems. On a couple of rather cheap graphite rods the fit isn’t very good and I have to check them often. Still, even though I’ve had them fly off, I’ve never had one break. The second problem occurs in rods that have been very heavily used to the point that the ferrules have worn badly over years of use. These were due for retirement anyway. The third reason is the obvious one of operater error. Still, none of these problems have resulted in a broken rod. I’ve had a very interesting lesson in ferrule construction. Some years back, when the dollar and the pound were in a more advantageous configuration, I purchased a Daiwa, Osprey, 15,’ 10/11 wt. spey rod designed by Noburu (?) before he went out on his own, and built in Scotland by Scots. I won’t tell you the price. I hate to see grownups cry. ::) The ferrules on this rod have, by a long shot, the longest area of contact between male and female sections and the shallowest, tightest fitting ferrule taper I have ever encountered on a rod. I never worry about taping it or about the sections coming apart. It’s an example that I believe the other rod manufacturers should take a hard look at.
My advice is send the inexcuseably defective rod (considering their price) back and express your displeasure!!! [smiley=thumbdown.gif]
Good Luck,
MarcThe most amazing thing about Mr. Grant’s casting ability may not have been the distances that he reached. His efforts were aimed at fishing well and catching fish and all else seemed to be subordinate to that goal. He wanted his fly to start working to attract fish from the moment it hit the water. Thus, He developed the ability to lay his line out in such a way that at no time was it not under tension. This meant that it hit the water with almost no slack. After he made his unofficial cast of 74 yds, the “official” who measured the cast then grabbed the end of the line and pulled. He was only able to pull about 6″ of slack out of the line!!
OK Zach. You have roused me from my laziness. I did a bit of research on Alexander Grant (Thanks–I couldn’t remember his name.) and found an illuminating article in “Fish and Fly.” It may be found at: http://www.fishandfly.com/articles/20060902_10
Hi All;
I just joined, saw this post and couldn’t resist replying. I hadn’t heard about this new SA line, but I’m not surprised. Apparrently Airflo’s new Ridgeline has been selling like hotcakes. So–a little history and theory about fly lines with uneven surfaces: Until a couple of years ago, the longest cast with a fly rod and line was made quite a long time ago with a bamboo spey rod and a silk line. I don’t remember exactly, but it was over 200 feet. This record held for decades and was only recently beaten with rod and line of modern, synthetic materials. If you’ve ever cast a silk line, I’m sure you noticed the sort of buzzing hiss when the line was shooting out through the guides. Being woven, it had an uneven surface. The smooth surfaced PVC covered lines that we’re all so used to cause excess friction by being uniformly in contact with the guides all the way out. As well, the uneven surface probably reduces the friction while traveling through the air. You know those dimples on a golf ball? They disrupt the air flowing over that ball in such a way as to reduce the friction. A smooth ball simply won’t travel as far. Some years ago, Fenwick produced and sold some lines with a seemingly rough (at least it was uneven) surface to reduce friction. Unfortunately, as near as I can tell, they forgot to promote this feature and it seems to have flopped. I have a couple of these lines and nowhere on the package or materials does it seem to mention this feature and it’s purpose. I think folks thought it was just a crummy line.
If one will go to the Airflo site and read about their ridgelines, they state that the ridges actually cause the line to shed dirt more readily than smooth ones. Don’t know but I haven’t heard anyone arguing the point. An uneven line is no more likely to wear a guide than a smooth one. In fact it may be less likely to do so because it’s in contact with the guide less. What really causes wear is abrasion by material that is of equal or greater hardness than the guide–in other words, grit in dirt. A very clean line will cause next-to-no wear.
I’m a little puzzled by the apparent high price of this new SA line. The fact that they say it will last much longer than other lines must mean that the materials that it is made of are different and, presumably, more durable. Has anyone heard? The Airflo lines have a polypropylene coating and are gauranteed against cracking but aren’t significantly more expensive than other premium lines. Has anyone had experience with these?Happy flogging,
J. Marcus
http://www.flyrodjewelry.com/home
