Very Cool, Very innovative commercial for the XSI
- This topic has 18 replies, 8 voices, and was last updated Jun 4, 2008 at 5:03 pm by
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But oh so misleading and underhanded, not cool Canon.
http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/content_page.asp?cid=7-9310-9451
eveyrthing, everything you see, was shot with 1DMKIII’s.
DAMNIT-
That was going to be my intro into digital. But have no fear lads-This week, Canon began a $300 rebate on the 5D and a $200 rebate on the 40D. And as I have noted before, I am sure the 40D will do more thanIf you do go the 40 Dusty it will be alot of body for you to grow into. Waiting to see what rebates they announce up here myself.
Cool way to put the add together but Im thinking they wouldnt get those kinds and quality of shots with XSI 🙂 Especially football at night .Cant beleive they didnt even put a wee fine print disclaimer that all shots were with a mkIII and not XSIs.
Gotta love marketing
John, don’t know if “underhanded” is the word. Misleading–perhaps. But Canon had a press release on this several days ago before the Galbraith article.
http://www.usa.canon.com/templatedata/pressrelease/20080519_eos_rebel_powershot_ad.html
Scott
Does another substantial price drop on the 5d further suggest a new full frame replacement model this summer???
You have to almost beleive the 5D replacement i coming soon.
As for spot. In my line of work transparency and disclosure is everything. How hard would it have been to add a fine print disclaimer that despite being a commercial for the XSI all images were shot with Canons Flahship Pro body..There XSI is not capable of the those football sequences, alteast not at that quality and especially not at night (high) ISOs, probably 1,600. I dontknow if my 1DMKIIn would be 🙂
The first television spot, “Journey,” focuses on the EOS Rebel XSi and was shot primarily with Canon EOS-1D Mark III professional digital SLR cameras.
Other than 1 brief glimpse o f the XSI at the end with a 1DMKIII image of a football player diving into the end zone at night superimposed on the XSIs lcd I might add, theres nothing in the spot to tha has anything at to do with the XSI.
Its all their top of he line Pro Body
🙂Now maybe its just me but of the millions of people who know nothing about photography, and even less about a makers bodies but I dont think its a leap at all to think there might be thousands of people who are sold on XSIs thinking wow it can do that 🙂 and then endup wondering..Why cant I do that ( a couple months ater)
Hell even automotive ads atleast tell the potential “consumers” that its been shot on a closed coarse with a professional driver and they certailny dont disguse Ferrari engines and chasis for Chevy Cavaliers and Ford Escorts commercials
🙂Underhanded, yeah I think so.
All it would have taken was a 5 second disclaimer “disclosing” the fact that the images being highlighted werent shot with XSIs but were instead shot with their flagship body. Kind of odd when its a commercial for an entry level body.It is a stretch to be true – I’m not sure how misleading though – and here’s why I say that; how misleading about quality of imagery can you be as A) fast as that’s blowing by and B) when we’re talking about 72 dpi imagery?
I mean – given the low-res of the presentation, you might be able to push things a lot with a lesser camera, and come close enough that folks out there not in the know wouldn’t know the difference.
That *might* have been their (Canon) rationale.
All that said, I’ve walked the marketing path before, and were it me I’d have been damn sure to have shot it with that new body – I mean, wth – that’s just stupid not to, and not to say “Look how friggin’ cool our camera is – we made this snazzy commercial using it!”
Implying it is less than graceful.
Kendal
I don’t understand the issue with the commercial. They’re selling a feeling or an idea of the ability to take photographs of any possible moment of life that you experience. There is a V.O. saying that with the XSI you can capture these images. Just think back to the old Rebel commercials with Agassi playing. There were probably still frames in there that we’re shot on the 35mm motion picture film camera and held as a freeze frame. Would that misleading as well?
To be honest, I’m really surprised to hear that this was shot with a still camera instead of HD or 35mm. That must have been a pain in the you know what to edit and composite. With all the rounds of revisions that client’s usually come back with… yikes, I feel for the post team on that one!http://society6.com/grainfarmer Fly Fishing and Landscape open edition Photography prints.
http://grainfarmer.vsco.co/ iPhone photos
http://instagram.com/chad_simcox InstagramI don’t understand the issue with the commercial. They’re selling a feeling or an idea….
Right, but see now we’re getting to the root of the issue.
Chad I’m looking at it from the POV of a consumer who knows nothing about Canons Bodies, or any body for that matter. They aren’t going to know any better, let alone Canon has these things called MKIIIs that can shoot acceptable images at ISO 1600..unlike the XSI, have super fast focusing..unlike the XSI, accurate focus trackin (unlike the XSI), 10 fps (unlike the XSI) and so on 🙂 If the XSI was even reasonably capable of those football sequences, don’t you think they’d have used them 🙂
Would Ford use a “Focus” body over a Mustang chasis & engine, and promo a commercial for Ford Focus road trip and likewise call it the ” family journey”?
Its a great spot, but in dire need of a disclaimer and is extremely misleading.
/edit just wanted to add.
I completely see and understand your point. However Canon could have easily changed the tone/direction/cant find it word 🙂 simply by making it a generic Canon “Brand” commercial that didn’t refer to or give the impressoin that is was a promo for a body, which this certainly and atleast to me stronglyI’m not saying that it could be seen that way or that most people won’t see it that way. The spot is as much about branding Canon as it is the XSI. *Oh and earlier I meant to say there isn’t a voice over saying this was shot with the XSI.
It always comes down to Caveat Emptor… do your research before you buy.
Watching the spot again, I’m looking at the lighting on the last sequence. I’m pretty sure that isn’t normal stadium lighting. I’ve got a feeling that those photos were shot at a lower ISO and the scene was lit with a number of high wattage HMI lights. The lighting ratios are nice, and the light looks kind of low for stadium lighting.
If you’re interested in the info, here is part of the team that it took to create this spot (I omitted alot of the producer and supervisor credits):
From what I can find, the spot was shot completely in LA at various locations.Agency: Grey, NY
Creative Directors: Ari Halper, Stephen Krauss
Art Director: Doug Fallion
Production Company: Anonymous Content, Los Angeles
Director: Andrew Douglas
DP: Flor Collins 2
Producer: Aris McGarry
Post/Effects: Asylum
Visual Effects Supervisor: Paul O’ Shea
On Set Visual Effects Supervisor: Marc Varisco
Producer: Mark Kurtz
Inferno Artist: Miles Essmiller
3D Tracking: Eddie Offerman
Matte Painting: Tim Clark
Texturing: Alexi Steinhauer
Rotoscoping: Junko Schugardt, Chris Cortese, Merlin Carroll
Editor: Michael Elliot @ Mad River
EP: Laura Relovsky
Telecine: Company 3
Colorist: Stefan Sonnenfeld
Music: Sacred Noise Composer: Michael Montes Music Producer: Jared Schlemovitzhttp://society6.com/grainfarmer Fly Fishing and Landscape open edition Photography prints.
http://grainfarmer.vsco.co/ iPhone photos
http://instagram.com/chad_simcox InstagramWell, guys, I bought one anyway, despite knowing about this commercial. I decided, after many of your replies and advice from friends, to save the money for an L series lens instead of buying the 40D. Plus, I am thinking that after I get a better grip on all of the gear, I may want a full frame, and with what I have read here lately, we may be seeing one soon if the 5D is replaced/upgraded.
I would love to give you a review, but now I do not think I could offer any helpful info. However, as a DSLR neophyte, I must say that navigating my way through this body’s controls is very easy. I broke a general man rule and actually read the manual, and it was quite helpful. That, coupled with Peterson’s input, has produced some descent pics lately.
Dusty
Well, guys, I bought one anyway, despite knowing about this commercial. I decided, after many of your replies and advice from friends, to save the money for an L series lens instead of buying the 40D. Plus, I am thinking that after I get a better grip on all of the gear, I may want a full frame, and with what I have read here lately, we may be seeing one soon if the 5D is replaced/upgraded.
Dusty, don’t sweat it 🙂
The problem with the commercial isn’t that the XSI is bad, imo it’s that they shot it with 1DMKIII and *impiled* by way of not disclosing that fact, that the XSI is capable of that kind of shooting/picture quality which it’s not in the main.The best anology I can think of again is cars. Would you be dissapointed with buying a new Mustang? Probably only if your racing it, or comparing it against Ferraris and Porches and Infinitys. With regards to the route you took theres nothing wrong with that either, if you plan to get some L glass. It’s the route I took in fact. Pound for pound glass is probably more important and glass last…..bodies dont.
My first body was a Rebel XT and I bought some L glass. In time when I had the money I bought some ore glass and some more accessorries. Then I moved to the 30D/40D and ultimately the 1D. Others may opt to get the best body they can initially and wait longer for glass purchases. I don’t know thats theres a right/wrong approach, both have their “selling” points. Thats also why I can speak to this with some authority. There isnt a Canon body line I havent owned and shot with and while Canon has added features to each they aren’t about to radically change the inner components.Starting with noise. All else being equal the larger the sensors the larger the photosites ( doodads that collect the light). The larger the photosites, the less the noise. This is why full frame bodies produce less noise, than 1.3 crop bodies, which in turn produce less noise than 1.6 and 1.7 crop bodies, which in turn produce far less noise than Point and Shoots which have teeny weeny sensors. This is inarguable. Then there are other smaller factors like the strength of the AA filters and so on.
This was shot with the 30D and 85mm @ ISO 1,250
This was shot with the 1DMKIIn and 85mm at ISO 1,600
While both would have had a little noise treatment done in post even at web display resolutions the difference is very noticeable.
Now for the average parent who’s shooting their kids event…Really who cares.. I shoot my daughters gymanastics at ISO 1600 all the time and while theres enough noise that makes printing any large impossible…again who cares. I don’t, nor should you.
That said just remember that that the Rebel Lines noise tolerance is around 400. At 800 there will be noise. The 30/40D I found the tolerance to be ISO 800
This is the Rebel at ISO 800. Even at 800 X 550 you can see some
**********On FPS.
The difference between 3.5 fps and 10fps.See the shot of the girl diving for the ball.. With the 1D I got the precise moment when she made contact with the ball. With a Rebel gettting *that* moment is improbalbe. We (humans) dont react fast enough, and theres always some shutter lag. You might get the ball when its 2 feet away, or out of the frame afterwards. It all depends on how fast the action is.
I should add with the 30D I *never* got those shots. The ball was always too far away, or too late after the fact and that was at 5 fps. Nor did it seem able to focus fast enough or stay with the player as they moved from stationary to jumping/diving.or this one
or these two
image # 2773
image # 2775
The two frames are taken 0.2 seconds apart. With an XSI its extremely unlikely you’d get either. In the time it takes a Rebel to fire two frames a MKIII will have 6. Further given that the MKIII and MKIIN run on two chips vs 1 chip, the one or two frames the Rebel records may and probably wont be in focus. The abilty to “snap to” and track in the case of AI servo is very different and when shooting fast action, fractions of a second matter. Look how much the Rainbow has moved in 1/10th of a second. With and XSI its out and back in the water before the 2nd frame fires.
Thats the problem with highly demanding photogrpahy like sports and action sequences and thus this spot. Its extremely demanding of the hardware and because you have a requirement of “freezing” the action (high Shutter speeds) that means high ISOs in less than ideal light.
Look that those Volley Ball shots which were taken at 1/500th or so and ISO 1,000 +.
Theres still some motiion blur and I daresay as bad as the light is in gym courts its better than what available during night football. They even show sequences shot at night and in (manufactored rain).Please.
The other thing is things like focus expansion ( a setting only in 1D bodies) for low contrast situations (cough night football cough) and precision calibration (lens to body).
Could have have the done the spot using some other types of photogrpahy? Meaning less “demanding” of hardware stuff…Kids playing a beach, landscape, portraits, etc..
I think they could in which case atleast to me its less an issue that used MKIIIs and made a commercial for the XSI.Are the shots “impossible”. Depends.
But the likeklyhood of getting a football player running at night or in the rain, diving into the endzone at the critical moment with IQ that good is remote, especially when the moving targets are “close”. Its one thing to capture action at a distance, its quite another to capture action when its in your face and filling the frame.
Theres lots of reasons why MKIIIs are 5 times the price of XSIs and probably not in my lifetime 🙂 The MKIII is *the* premier sports/action body bar none.
Does any of that mean your XSI is “bad”.
NopeIts just an incredibly misleading and imo underhanded way to promote the XSI
Bill,
I bought the XSi, sorry for the misleading post. As far as the glass, I still do not know as I need to do some more research, and save some money. I have been looking at B & H, but am having a hard time finding more than one or two options for “L” f/2,8 glass. the way I understand things, for now, I need to focus on acquiring a good f/2.8, a good 50 or 60 mm macro, and then a good wide angle lens. But, as I said, I still need to spend some time getting to understand the different lenses and their applications.John,
As always, your posts are very helpful. I wish I could have found some explanations like the ones you give that are concise and point out the pros and cons to each body. I am hoping the XSi will be a good entry point for me, a body which will prepare me for a pro body in time. I have begun to notice one problem though: most of the glass I have seen for the XSi will only mount to the rebel series and the 10, 20, 30, and 40D. I take this to mean that if and when I buy a 5D or above, none of the glass I purchase now will work with the pro body! am I correct in this?Where should I be looking for lenses, assuming my plan of lens purchase is a sound one?
Thanks again guys,
DustyCant really help with where to look for purchases Dusty, I’m a Canuck although I’ve heard nothing but good things about B&H.
With regards to lens compatability and future body purchases the lenses that wont be compatible are any EF-S lenses. Things like the 15-55 kit, the 17/85 IS etc. There are dozens of lenses for you to choose from that will go from body to body as you update at some future point.
If you want to get some “L” glass than *I* would identify which type of photography is the most important to me and plan accordingly.
meaning: If WA stuff is important than I’d look to get a 17-40 f4, a 24-70 f2.8, a 24/105 f4, a 16-35 f2.8 etc and put off L glass in other areas until down the road.
You dont have to get L glass at every point. Sure you might want to be there one day, but I dont know many people other than 1 or 2 people who could go out and buy the best at every focal range and specilaty applications ( macro, super tele).
If you want fast glass initially you could get a 50mm f1.4 or 85mm f1.8. Neither are L but both are very good. Fast glass is great for low light, narrow DoF, portraits of kids etc. And plan for a 70-200 f4 L or 70-200 f2.8 L for a top line mid range zoom and use the 17-55mm until you upgrade that in a year or two etc.
For example.
You could spend $1,000 to $1,200 on a 70-200 f4 L and 85mm f1.8. Youd have the 18-55 kit, the 85mm F1.8 and the 70-200 f4 L. That kit would give you alot of options from 18 to 200mm and an option for fast glass in the 85mm f1.8or you could drop $1,500 on a 24-70 f2.8, 24-105 or 70-200 F2.8 (non IS)
etc.
Planning glass purchases can drive you to drink
John,
So I only need to avoid EF-S and IS lenses to assure they will work with future bodies? what is the designation of the lenses I need to be looking for?Those are some good suggestions regarding three lenses vs. one. I guess my mentality said “one of the best rather than three good.”
I don’t disagree with anything John said, but I would add that if you don’t have $4,000 or $8,000 for one of the MK III bodies, you will get better pictures with one of the lesser DSLR than you will with a P&S. Jump in at the price point you can afford, buy good glass, then continue saving your money to upgrade your body as John stated he had done.
If you want to avoid buying a lens that might one day be obsolete due to buying a full fram like a 5D or 1D series body you want to buy EF lenses. Lenses with IS are fine, thats the acronym for Image Stabalistion. A number of lenses have that. Its a nice albeit pricey feature, generally it doubles or near double the price. You can buy the 70-200 f4 L for about 600-700, the IS version is about 1,400.00
Heres the list of the EF lenses
http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ProductCatIndexAct&fcategoryid=111Initial lenses.
tough decision that only the buyer can decide. Is it better to buy 3 and cover a range of options vs 1 great lens?I did both 🙂
I bought the 100-400 L to go with my Rebel XT. Then the 400 f5.6 and 85 f1.8.
and so on.But I knew I wanted todo wildlife photography and I wasn’t going to mind being patient to get the rest. Here I am years later and I still havent bought a mid range lens (70-200). Thats probably next late this year or next.
Maybe you can go the first year with the kit 18-55, 50 f1.4 and 100mm f2.8 macro.
While you won’t have much reach you will have from 18 to 100. Two fast lenses ( although the macro is slow to focus) for low light, portraits etc and a macro lens. Cost to buy those two is about $1,100.Me write?
Lol, not a bloody chance, I’m nowhere near qualified, not even remotely. I know enough to offer some advice to people getting started and in large part its from what I learned. Kind of a been there, done thatNo sales person explained to me that Rebels started showing noise above ISO 400, they didnt explain photosites and sensor sizes, and AA filters. Or that AI servo couldnt *reliably* track fast moving subjects, or that Pro Bodies had two chips and on and on and on.
As you learn the camera you’ll learn how to overcome some of that ( Snipe vs Burst), make sure to overexpose a bit to reduce noise and so on and so on.
How many will explain that IS for example does squat for “motion Blur”. But thanks for your hard eanred cash all the same…….:) Yet if you look at many marketing hype example images of IS, VR, Anti shake etc, they show a blurred dog leaping ( no IS ) and a crystal clear dog mid air thanks to IS 🙂Not earth breaking things and certainly not the be all and end all just things first time buyers often arent aware of. Does everyone need the best of the best? No, and as Bill said any body is a good body and a step up from PnSs. As much as a XSI may not be able to shoot a football game at night, in the rain and get alot of “keepers” (relative term …whats a keeper to a Pro and whats a keeper to a parent are worlds apart) its still going to do alot better than a PnS.
less noise
Less shutter lag
More FPS
Better metering
better predictive focusing
Higher max shutter speeds
and on
and on.
🙂My point isnt that its a “bad” or incapable body, its that Canon used a Ferrari to promote a Mustang ;). Your going to love what it does and really thats all that matters.
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