Bass rods redux
- This topic has 18 replies, 12 voices, and was last updated Jun 12, 2009 at 7:35 pm by
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Abe,
The only thing that I can really add to the conversation is that while the line situation with the Sage SMB may be an issue, the rod itself has a heck of a backbone for throwing big bugs. I’ve thrown big clousers and poppers with it, and have had no problem launching them a long distance while maintaining control. As for the line, I fished the rod last when it was still pretty cold out, and I found that the line seemed to have a lot of memory, even after fishing it for an hour. Perhaps this was because of the temperature, but it did not seem to be as memory free as some of my Rio lines. That being said, not having cast the rod with any other line, I am not sure if the rod would perform as well with a stock line.
I am typically a Scott fan, but I think Sage did something pretty special with the SMB.
Best,
Dave
Pretty sure the line is just a Rio outbound, prob a 230 grain floater for the SM and a 300 grain floater for the LM rods.
Learning how to match rods by grain weight and not what the box says is a big deal in getting the right line for each different action and rod wt. You can really dial in a rod by experimenting with different grain wts. Rio is great about listing head weights for most of the lines on their site.
Abe there’s a very straightforward solution – load up your 5 ZAxis with a 6 weight line. The greater weight in the head will do two things – carry the fly better and bend the rod deeper in the butt thus by proxy making it a slower rod. I think the Clouser line would be a good line for this or shop around for bass line with its short chunky head. Or get a 230 grain Sage bass line and string that through the guides. I have both a 5 Zed and a 230 grain bass line, I’ll pair them up tomorrow and let you know how they tango, its night time here in Australia and its pissing with rain ::)
Its important to also remember that when you’re throwing big wind resistant flies the end of your line is going to be travelling slower than it would with a small fly, so you need to adjust your timing, that essential pause as you wait for the line to straighten out in the air is going to have to be longer. Technique is pretty important.
Alternatively the Sage Bluegill is a very sweet little rod that also has applications on trout streams where big streamers are required.
Morsie
Abe, I own the LMB rod from SAGE and a few of the others that you have own your list. You are right about the Xi2 being fast. Try up lining two weights and I think it will get better for the big bugs. I have a 9 weight Clouser line on my Xi2 and it works well.
The LMB is nice for BASS stuff but, it has no soul. The Bass rod will cast a small house cat into a head wind and uproot stumps. I have a older St.Croix Ultra Legend #8 that is a great bass rod and it works very well with a Clouser line (as does most rods).
Mike Anderson hit it on the head with the Rio Outbound line. I think that is what make the SAGE BASS rod work so well. I have been fooling around with the Rio Outbound (short) on a few rods and it is the best line I have ever found for casting BIG STUFF.
I have kinda lost it as of late and got on a Helios kick and bought 5,6,8 and 10 weights. Best rods I have ever cast period. In the smaller weights the Helios maybe is not that much different that a Z-axis but, when you start blind casting big streamers on a 350-500gr head for a long period of time it sure pays off. They have a nice med fast action with lots of soul.
If I were in your shoes I would try a Rio Outbound (short) in a 9 weight and get some really stiff mono or even a big game leader ad some 15 or 20 pound tippet.
Abe,
I guide for smallmouth bass and throw bass bugs a lot for them. When I fish on my own I use my 6wt. Z-axis with Rio’s VersiTip in a 6wt, and use the Clouser floating tip. With clients I use a couple different Sage 7wts. with Rio Clouser lines in 7wt. All of the rods are fast action. I have never had any problems or my clients had problems casting bass bugs with these set ups. It is all about finding a comfortable casting stroke. I can cast over 60ft. easily with a bass bug on my 6wt. Z-axis, I just adjust my stroke a little bit. I also have a 6wt. TCX that I use and have it loaded with the Outbound short in a 6wt. One word, cannon. This thing casts a mile and throws big flies like nobody’s business. The 8wt. Outbound short would be a great choice to get for your Xi2, you canget an 8wt. Clouser line for your Xi2. This set up would be just fine. Either way these two lines would work great on your Xi2. I have fished both on a 7wt. Xi2 with the corresponding line wt. and thought they worked great.
-Mike
my normal LM/SM bass rod is my T3 10′ 6wt.
i think i’m throwing polyfuse bright orange something or other 7wt.i don’t toss huge flies and my new foam bugs are mostly silhouette and no weight (craft foam + super hair) with a damsel nymph dropper.
i’ve taken my (7′) 3wt out on the lake and 5wt (8’6″-9′) which is fun, but the 6 allows me to cover more water and cast further.
small rod = more fun, more energy to fish
big rod = smidgen less fun, less energy expendedJust note that if you do buy an Outbound short its already uplined 2 weights, don’t go buying a 10 for an 8 because its really a 12………
Morsie
I’m toying with the idea of getting a Sage LMB for the reasons you mention Abe. Big Bass Flys, wind and wanting/needing to get it out there.
However, I don’t do alot of fishing that requires long cast and as such it’s not something Ive ever spent alot of time practising. 90% of my fly fishing is cold water and the need to lay out line, with big flies is virtually nil
So when I go for Bass and Musky on my time and I want to use Flies it can be a struggle. I won’t call the Sage Bass rods “gimmicks”, everyone I’ve talked to have raved about their ability to launch lines. I might say they are better suited to people like me. If I was a better caster, if I was inclined to spend the time practising more I’d not consider one, too limited in my mind. If your a decent caster, but just not used to bass flies, dollars to donuts its just unfamiliarity and you could do it with whatever you get and just a little practise
Just FWIW the Bass rods are made to be tournament legal, that’s why they’re shorter, other then that they aren’t any different then any other fly rod. The line configuration and the fact that Sage has matched the rod to the proper grain weight Outbound (shooting head floater) is what makes them cast so well. Like I said earlier you can do this with any rod above a 4wt. I guess fishing shooting heads is something a lot of folks don’t do…
Abe, in your original post you asked how a Scott G might do with poppers. If you go to Harry Murray’s website (http://www.murraysflyshop.com) he talks about just that thing. He basically has his own brand of bass rod in 7wt & 8wt 9′ made for him by Scott. It is a G rod and he claims the slower action with a bend deeper in to the butt of the rod helps in casting bigger wind resistant flies. I don’t know if any of it is true or not, but he basically claims the old G is the best bass rod in his opinion. The Scott Gs he sells through his shop are around the $695 range which I think puts them out of the market for purely bass rods. If you have an old G or can get you hands on one it might be a good route to go. There is basically no difference in the rods that I can see except that they are marketed through Murray’s shop as an exclusive and it is the only place you can get a new one.
Another thing you might want to check out is the following review by Joe Cornwall (http://www.flyfishohio.com/Bass_Rod_Review.htm). He does a thorough review of the the Sage, Legend Ultra and Scott Warmwater rods. It is a good review and worth checking out.
I have 2 of the LMB rods from Sage on board and what makes them so much fun is the ability to make under hand, sidearm and reverse back hand cast to spot’s that are just out of reach with most rods. People that have never had a fly rod in the hands will start making decent cast with’n a half hour. That what makes these rods so special. Try bouncing a big frog bug under a limb with a 8 foot rod from 30 feet.. But beware, you will have to have two LMB rods onboard, they are really hard to share. >:( This is my partner at last months Bass-N-Fly tourny in Northern Ca. We finished 7th out of 39 teams.
http://www.bassnfly.com/Event%20Blog/F48F1B2F-677B-48FD-93B3-413C2DB78BFA.html
Abe, I finally got around to stringing up the 5 ZAxis with the 230 grain Sage bass line (Bluegill). It had the desired effect and it feels like you could throw a boot with it.
Morsie
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